Comments on: Q & A: On Old Strategies and Today’s Markets http://www.curtisfaith.com/2009/10/12/qa-on-old-strategies-and-todays-markets/ A Turtle Master's Insights on the Art of the Trade Wed, 18 Jan 2012 16:49:41 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: Gary http://www.curtisfaith.com/2009/10/12/qa-on-old-strategies-and-todays-markets/comment-page-1/#comment-585 Gary Sat, 18 Dec 2010 21:02:50 +0000 http://www.curtisfaith.com/?p=129#comment-585 Has anyone studied using the original Turtle method trading stocks instead of futures? Gary Has anyone studied using the original Turtle method trading stocks instead of futures?
Gary

]]> By: joseph kaufman http://www.curtisfaith.com/2009/10/12/qa-on-old-strategies-and-todays-markets/comment-page-1/#comment-151 joseph kaufman Sun, 31 Oct 2010 20:39:39 +0000 http://www.curtisfaith.com/?p=129#comment-151 Would like to speak to Trader Jim if he wants to drop me an email. jkaufman@netvision.net.il Would like to speak to Trader Jim if he wants to drop me an email.
jkaufman@netvision.net.il

]]> By: Trader Jim http://www.curtisfaith.com/2009/10/12/qa-on-old-strategies-and-todays-markets/comment-page-1/#comment-120 Trader Jim Fri, 30 Jul 2010 08:37:00 +0000 http://www.curtisfaith.com/?p=129#comment-120 In all due respect to Curtis, the markets have not "changed". The markets are what they always have been (and always will be), the sum of the emotions and actions of the traders who trade them. There may have been changes in the way traders implement their trades in the markets in the past 20 years because of computer trading and easier access to brokers through the internet, but that doesn't mean the markets themselves have changed. I would instead offer that Curtis has changed since his days as a turtle for whatever reason... this is apparent when you read "Trading From Your Gut"... the title alone is considered blasphemy by trend followers. As far as long term trend following and "turtle style" systems, they are alive and well. I'm living proof of that! My own system was based on the original turtle rules and my personal returns for the past 10 years average out to almost 100% per year. Does it take more consistency and discipline now then it did in the Turtle days? Probably not... but most people can't come close to acheiving that level of discipline anyway, let alone take the time to master the subjects of risk, money management and trading psychology in tandem to develop a truly complete trading system. If you want to become a successful trend follower be prepared to commit at least a few years of study and patient practice of trading a trend following method... now that takes "guts". In all due respect to Curtis, the markets have not “changed”. The markets are what they always have been (and always will be), the sum of the emotions and actions of the traders who trade them.

There may have been changes in the way traders implement their trades in the markets in the past 20 years because of computer trading and easier access to brokers through the internet, but that doesn’t mean the markets themselves have changed. I would instead offer that Curtis has changed since his days as a turtle for whatever reason… this is apparent when you read “Trading From Your Gut”… the title alone is considered blasphemy by trend followers.

As far as long term trend following and “turtle style” systems, they are alive and well. I’m living proof of that! My own system was based on the original turtle rules and my personal returns for the past 10 years average out to almost 100% per year. Does it take more consistency and discipline now then it did in the Turtle days? Probably not… but most people can’t come close to acheiving that level of discipline anyway, let alone take the time to master the subjects of risk, money management and trading psychology in tandem to develop a truly complete trading system.

If you want to become a successful trend follower be prepared to commit at least a few years of study and patient practice of trading a trend following method… now that takes “guts”.

]]> By: Louis http://www.curtisfaith.com/2009/10/12/qa-on-old-strategies-and-todays-markets/comment-page-1/#comment-105 Louis Tue, 15 Jun 2010 08:58:03 +0000 http://www.curtisfaith.com/?p=129#comment-105 Hi Curtis, Great stuff. Love your work. One question. Let’s say, for example, that a trader had a large, successful, once a year trade using system 1 or 2 that was exited for a 20% or more gain. Would you recommend the trader avoid trading on the same side of that market for a while? Did the original system account for this? In other words, could the system anticipate the end of the trend and the likelihood that a sideways trend would develop near term? Are there any clues at all that a sideways trend is developing and that one should avoid trend chasing for a certain period of time? Very best, Louis Hi Curtis,

Great stuff. Love your work.

One question.

Let’s say, for example, that a trader had a large, successful, once a year trade using system 1 or 2 that was exited for a 20% or more gain. Would you recommend the trader avoid trading on the same side of that market for a while? Did the original system account for this?

In other words, could the system anticipate the end of the trend and the likelihood that a sideways trend would develop near term? Are there any clues at all that a sideways trend is developing and that one should avoid trend chasing for a certain period of time?

Very best,
Louis

]]> By: Rowland http://www.curtisfaith.com/2009/10/12/qa-on-old-strategies-and-todays-markets/comment-page-1/#comment-31 Rowland Tue, 10 Nov 2009 18:35:07 +0000 http://www.curtisfaith.com/?p=129#comment-31 Curtis: I loved Way of the Turtle! You make some good points about the simplicity of systems and also about filters in helping smooth systems out. It is obvious if you look at Turtles and 2nd gen Turtles that are still trading, that their numbers, while still good, are not a big as in the 70s and 80s (ie. annualized trend of returns is going down). What systems and filters are you drawn toward now that seem to highlight the inefficiencies in markets today? Also, being that things that are out of favor tend to start doing well, are you expecting a return of Turtle style trend trading in the future sometime? Curtis:
I loved Way of the Turtle! You make some good points about the simplicity of systems and also about filters in helping smooth systems out. It is obvious if you look at Turtles and 2nd gen Turtles that are still trading, that their numbers, while still good, are not a big as in the 70s and 80s (ie. annualized trend of returns is going down). What systems and filters are you drawn toward now that seem to highlight the inefficiencies in markets today? Also, being that things that are out of favor tend to start doing well, are you expecting a return of Turtle style trend trading in the future sometime?

]]> By: Anthony Garner http://www.curtisfaith.com/2009/10/12/qa-on-old-strategies-and-todays-markets/comment-page-1/#comment-20 Anthony Garner Thu, 15 Oct 2009 20:21:59 +0000 http://www.curtisfaith.com/?p=129#comment-20 What a refreshing change to see an honest discussion of this old system and of trend following in general. It is a damn difficult route - the long deep drawdowns, while certainly no worse than those you can expect to suffer in the stockmarket, make LTTF a tough path to follow. Congratulations on your new website! What a refreshing change to see an honest discussion of this old system and of trend following in general. It is a damn difficult route – the long deep drawdowns, while certainly no worse than those you can expect to suffer in the stockmarket, make LTTF a tough path to follow.

Congratulations on your new website!

]]> By: Curtis Faith http://www.curtisfaith.com/2009/10/12/qa-on-old-strategies-and-todays-markets/comment-page-1/#comment-19 Curtis Faith Thu, 15 Oct 2009 14:44:46 +0000 http://www.curtisfaith.com/?p=129#comment-19 In looking at the way their respective returns have diverged it is pretty clear that William Eckhardt is using some thing radically different and that Jerry Parker is using a mix of long-term trend-following approaches. I doubt either one of them is using the Turtle System as we traded it for any of their funds. Richard Dennis only developed the Turtle System shortly before the Turtle program began. They had several other systems they considered teaching us at the time. Rich made most of his early money scalping in the pits and then he later started position trading. He was a fairly discretionary trader even at the time of the Turtle program. He definitely did not make his early money using the Turtle System or anything like it. In looking at the way their respective returns have diverged it is pretty clear that William Eckhardt is using some thing radically different and that Jerry Parker is using a mix of long-term trend-following approaches. I doubt either one of them is using the Turtle System as we traded it for any of their funds.

Richard Dennis only developed the Turtle System shortly before the Turtle program began. They had several other systems they considered teaching us at the time.

Rich made most of his early money scalping in the pits and then he later started position trading. He was a fairly discretionary trader even at the time of the Turtle program. He definitely did not make his early money using the Turtle System or anything like it.

]]> By: Gaia http://www.curtisfaith.com/2009/10/12/qa-on-old-strategies-and-todays-markets/comment-page-1/#comment-18 Gaia Thu, 15 Oct 2009 06:26:54 +0000 http://www.curtisfaith.com/?p=129#comment-18 Just curious 1. if the turtle don't effective anymore is William Eckhart and Jerry Parker still use turtle trading system ? 2. Is turtle system need quite amount money that mean richard dennis don't use turtle system when he start trading with 5000 $ ? Regards, Just curious
1. if the turtle don’t effective anymore is William Eckhart and Jerry Parker still use turtle trading system ?
2. Is turtle system need quite amount money that mean richard dennis don’t use turtle system when he start trading with 5000 $ ?

Regards,

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